Super fast 16+ PBEM DG? Or: "The more the faster!" - Page 4

Markstar · 02-06-2005, 17:37

Yep, I agree that we ought to keep it simple. I just suggested it so that nobody fights over a certain tribe.

Still waiting for some input on the map settings, I'm a little surprised that there is no outrage about me proposing totally even continents...or maybe it has gone unnoticed?

I expected a little more of

,

and

over the matter...

Beam · 02-06-2005, 18:15

Most if not all maps for group games have been either highly balanced or identical (Swimming Pool, 2x2x2x2, 2 maps for on-line games) and I've only read positive comments so it looks like the way to go. I'd personally prefer highly balanced, not identical but that's the most elaborous type of map we can ask for.

Continents sounds good to me. Enable early contact always is the key parameter for continent maps, would be nice to have some input on that.

Just an idea about Civchoice: let every team choose the Civ they want to play with, if there are any doubles we can easily solve that in the editor. Nice addition: every team can choose a 3rd trait?

All thoughts and subject to discussion of course.

With 4 teams in place and 6 ppl on the list it might not be neccesary to go to other fora.

Matrix · 02-06-2005, 18:58

I think identical continents are boring.

(There he comes again.

)

Nevertheless I'd like to participate as well.

I don't care with whom I end up, but I prefer people I know well (e.g. by having met them in real life).

romeothemonk · 02-06-2005, 19:18

The other thing is that you can have five choices for civs, then do a lottery pick, to see who picks first.
Example
Team Engineer (G-man and I)
1. Sumeria
2. Iro
3. Greece
4. Babs
5. Celts
Team Markstar
1. Sumeria
2. Japan
3. China
4. Portugal
5. America

Markstar's team gets first pick through a random drawing, pulls Sumeria. Engineer goes second gets Iro. A third team would be next and get the highest availible civ on their list.

I also do not like identical continents.

Kemal · 02-06-2005, 19:24

Posting to confirm my participation in this, sounds like a good idea indeed.

However, I'd personally wouldn't like the game to be modded much, besides the mandatory SoZ issues that every game has to be modded for. So I'd like for no 3rd traits nor double civs etc. That said, I agree that of course there needs to be some form of solution for double-choices, in the swimming pool it was done via a coinflip but as it turned out, that method sucks. [

]

But how about this:
Maybe double chosen civs should be out of the game altogether, where teams that double are forced to make a new choice excluding the doubled civs as well as the civs that weren't doubled but already picked by other teams in the first round? Makes initial choice of civ some sort of strategic decision already, I suppose... though it could lead to backdoor politics before the game start too.

Also, I'm in favour of either continents or archi type map, one landmass is imo not well suited for games with so many civs participating.

Whomp · 02-06-2005, 20:02

A thought regarding picking civs. Since there are many high level players here maybe a handicap could be created. Each of us vote by PM the 1st to 16th rated player(IE I'm the 16th best player

). The lowest total goes last on picking a civ and the highest total goes first.

Also, wouldn't archs be more interesting because it would allow for teams to
A. develop their island
B. Require a navy and
C.Force teams to really think out any attack plan so you don't get back doored with forces away from home.

grahamiam · 02-06-2005, 20:21

imho, random arch maps with 60% ocean generate the most interesting landmasses. mapmaker could tweak resources and a few tiles to get it more even, but leave it mostly random.

Beam · 02-06-2005, 20:39

Archie maps usually see little action early game, take the Swimming Pool (glad it is moving at good speed again

) as prime example. 8 players, one war afaik. In a years time. It is an enjoyable game btw, don't misunderstand.

On a sidenote: there are 4 complete teams and 7 more players listed. Without any intent to be managing a process I see 3 more complete teams and just 1 vacancy. Or am I missing something?

grahamiam · 02-06-2005, 20:41

well, we could make it a small map with 8 players, right? that would force the action a little sooner

Markstar · 02-06-2005, 20:53

- Well, I must say I don't like the throw-out-civs-that-were-selected-twice approach. There are only 7 agricultural civs there, ergo at least one team ends up without it and I don't think that's really fair. An alternative would also be of course not to include agricultural civs.

- About continents/islands: I'm fine with them being not identical or whatever, but I surely don't want one team having to cope with jungle (like CGN, but at least they got a great starting position) while other teams have plenty of cows around (and the surrounding terrain is much more important in C3C than it was in PTW).

How about a poll on these issues? (just an idea)

- Matrix, is it possible to use your turn tracker for the game? Would it be able to send an email to several recipients at the same time?

- Who is going to make the map? I don't want anybody not to play because of other responsibilites (other than RL of course). Of course there is always the option to reveal the map to everyone but I don't see this happening.

- While I certainly like the idea of being able to develop your island, there is one thing: It pretty eliminates the option of an early land war. Imho there are more options with a few neighbours around but I DO NOT have a problem with an archipelago.
Even a small map sound alright to me at this point (sort of a test run) if that's what you guys want.

- About posting at CFC/CGN: I contacted miccofl and Kuningas, miccofl is into Pirates! right now and waiting for Civ4 and I havn't hear from Kuningas (who wanted revenge after the last Fair Starts). But while we only need one more person to make the 16, I'd feel much more comfortable with filling up the teams (like 3 per team), especially since most of the guys not yet assigned have only a limited amount of time right now.
Of course if you guys want to keep it at two players per team that'd be alright, too. But if there are no objections I will post it tomorrow at around noon.

- I feel uncomfortable just assigning people to teams and would really feel much more comfortable if you guys could pick teams or if already established teams could invite players.

There have been several posts while I was writing this so sorry if it's a little messed up.

02-06-2005, 18:15	#32
Beam c00l b33r Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Beat 'm up Scotty!. Lives in the Lands that are Nether. Posts: 5,094	Most if not all maps for group games have been either highly balanced or identical (Swimming Pool, 2x2x2x2, 2 maps for on-line games) and I've only read positive comments so it looks like the way to go. I'd personally prefer highly balanced, not identical but that's the most elaborous type of map we can ask for. Continents sounds good to me. Enable early contact always is the key parameter for continent maps, would be nice to have some input on that. Just an idea about Civchoice: let every team choose the Civ they want to play with, if there are any doubles we can easily solve that in the editor. Nice addition: every team can choose a 3rd trait? All thoughts and subject to discussion of course. With 4 teams in place and 6 ppl on the list it might not be neccesary to go to other fora. __________________ That was a pretty good gamble. -- Scotty, The Galileo Seven, stardate 2821.5, Episode 14 Linux never looked this good!

02-06-2005, 18:58	#33
Matrix Administrator Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Tampere, Finland Posts: 4,828	I think identical continents are boring. (There he comes again. ) Nevertheless I'd like to participate as well. I don't care with whom I end up, but I prefer people I know well (e.g. by having met them in real life). __________________

02-06-2005, 19:18	#34
romeothemonk King Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Yankton, SD. Posts: 1,310	The other thing is that you can have five choices for civs, then do a lottery pick, to see who picks first. Example Team Engineer (G-man and I) 1. Sumeria 2. Iro 3. Greece 4. Babs 5. Celts Team Markstar 1. Sumeria 2. Japan 3. China 4. Portugal 5. America Markstar's team gets first pick through a random drawing, pulls Sumeria. Engineer goes second gets Iro. A third team would be next and get the highest availible civ on their list. I also do not like identical continents. __________________ I am not crazy cause I take the right pills..................................... Everyday

02-06-2005, 19:24	#35
Kemal Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Netherlands. Posts: 3,108	Posting to confirm my participation in this, sounds like a good idea indeed. However, I'd personally wouldn't like the game to be modded much, besides the mandatory SoZ issues that every game has to be modded for. So I'd like for no 3rd traits nor double civs etc. That said, I agree that of course there needs to be some form of solution for double-choices, in the swimming pool it was done via a coinflip but as it turned out, that method sucks. [] But how about this: Maybe double chosen civs should be out of the game altogether, where teams that double are forced to make a new choice excluding the doubled civs as well as the civs that weren't doubled but already picked by other teams in the first round? Makes initial choice of civ some sort of strategic decision already, I suppose... though it could lead to backdoor politics before the game start too. Also, I'm in favour of either continents or archi type map, one landmass is imo not well suited for games with so many civs participating. __________________ <b>\"In the Game of Thrones, you win or you die\" </b>

02-06-2005, 20:02	#36
Whomp King Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Chicago. Posts: 2,388	A thought regarding picking civs. Since there are many high level players here maybe a handicap could be created. Each of us vote by PM the 1st to 16th rated player(IE I'm the 16th best player ). The lowest total goes last on picking a civ and the highest total goes first. Also, wouldn't archs be more interesting because it would allow for teams to A. develop their island B. Require a navy and C.Force teams to really think out any attack plan so you don't get back doored with forces away from home. __________________ If at first you don't succeed, try, try again. Then quit. There's no point in being a damn fool about it.--W. C. Fields

02-06-2005, 17:37	#31
Markstar King Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Germany. Posts: 1,746	Yep, I agree that we ought to keep it simple. I just suggested it so that nobody fights over a certain tribe. Still waiting for some input on the map settings, I'm a little surprised that there is no outrage about me proposing totally even continents...or maybe it has gone unnoticed? I expected a little more of , and over the matter...

02-06-2005, 20:21	#37
grahamiam Emperor Join Date: May 2004 Location: USA, East Coast. Posts: 2,673	imho, random arch maps with 60% ocean generate the most interesting landmasses. mapmaker could tweak resources and a few tiles to get it more even, but leave it mostly random.

02-06-2005, 20:39	#38
Beam c00l b33r Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Beat 'm up Scotty!. Lives in the Lands that are Nether. Posts: 5,094	Archie maps usually see little action early game, take the Swimming Pool (glad it is moving at good speed again ) as prime example. 8 players, one war afaik. In a years time. It is an enjoyable game btw, don't misunderstand. On a sidenote: there are 4 complete teams and 7 more players listed. Without any intent to be managing a process I see 3 more complete teams and just 1 vacancy. Or am I missing something? __________________ That was a pretty good gamble. -- Scotty, The Galileo Seven, stardate 2821.5, Episode 14 Linux never looked this good!

02-06-2005, 20:41	#39
grahamiam Emperor Join Date: May 2004 Location: USA, East Coast. Posts: 2,673	well, we could make it a small map with 8 players, right? that would force the action a little sooner

02-06-2005, 20:53	#40
Markstar King Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Germany. Posts: 1,746	- Well, I must say I don't like the throw-out-civs-that-were-selected-twice approach. There are only 7 agricultural civs there, ergo at least one team ends up without it and I don't think that's really fair. An alternative would also be of course not to include agricultural civs. - About continents/islands: I'm fine with them being not identical or whatever, but I surely don't want one team having to cope with jungle (like CGN, but at least they got a great starting position) while other teams have plenty of cows around (and the surrounding terrain is much more important in C3C than it was in PTW). How about a poll on these issues? (just an idea) - Matrix, is it possible to use your turn tracker for the game? Would it be able to send an email to several recipients at the same time? - Who is going to make the map? I don't want anybody not to play because of other responsibilites (other than RL of course). Of course there is always the option to reveal the map to everyone but I don't see this happening. - While I certainly like the idea of being able to develop your island, there is one thing: It pretty eliminates the option of an early land war. Imho there are more options with a few neighbours around but I DO NOT have a problem with an archipelago. Even a small map sound alright to me at this point (sort of a test run) if that's what you guys want. - About posting at CFC/CGN: I contacted miccofl and Kuningas, miccofl is into Pirates! right now and waiting for Civ4 and I havn't hear from Kuningas (who wanted revenge after the last Fair Starts). But while we only need one more person to make the 16, I'd feel much more comfortable with filling up the teams (like 3 per team), especially since most of the guys not yet assigned have only a limited amount of time right now. Of course if you guys want to keep it at two players per team that'd be alright, too. But if there are no objections I will post it tomorrow at around noon. - I feel uncomfortable just assigning people to teams and would really feel much more comfortable if you guys could pick teams or if already established teams could invite players. There have been several posts while I was writing this so sorry if it's a little messed up.